He spoke about the impact of the crisis in Iran on the global economy, freedom of navigation in the Strait of Hormuz, Greek-Israeli relations, European strategic autonomy, and the trajectory of the Greek economy, Prime Minister Kyriakos Mitsotakis spoke on the Financial Times podcast “The Rachman Review” with the newspaper’s Chief Foreign Affairs Commentator, Gideon Rachman.
Below is a detailed transcript of Prime Minister Kyriakos Mitsotakis’s discussion with Gideon Rachman, Chief Foreign Affairs Commentator for the Financial Times, on the podcast “The Rachman Review.”
Gideon Rachman: Regarding the crisis in Iran, I get the sense that people are beginning to believe that the economic consequences will be felt, that prices will skyrocket if we don’t find a solution. So I’m wondering, how concerned are you about the economic dimension?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: I believe we should all be quite concerned. If this crisis continues in the foreseeable future, there will be significant consequences in the form of persistently higher inflation and lower growth, and this will force us all to adjust our economic planning in some way. It is an issue I have raised at the European Council level. Although I do not necessarily want to predict the worst-case scenario, I believe it is our duty as Europe to prepare for a negative outcome. Of course…
Gideon Rachman: But you’re already seeing it, aren’t you?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: We’re seeing it in the form of much higher inflation than we thought we’d face. This is certainly significant, because for all European governments, the cost of living must be the top priority. As for Greece, we are making use of whatever fiscal leeway we have. We have achieved a very impressive primary surplus for 2025, so we have additional fiscal space. We are using this fiscal space for targeted and temporary relief measures, but of course we know that this will not be enough.
Gideon Rachman: Do you have any sense of when shortages will emerge, whether for food, fertilizers, or oil?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: At present, we are not seeing any shortages of petroleum products, which is important for us. For example, when it comes to jet fuel, Greece is a major exporter of jet fuel to the rest of Europe. Therefore, I do not expect any shortages. I believe the problem will lie in the price level…
Gideon Rachman: Indeed.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: And, of course, in persistently high inflation, which is already exacerbating the cost-of-living crisis we had to deal with even before this war broke out.
Gideon Rachman: And of course, the longer this goes on, the worse the situation gets. From what I understand, over the weekend you were at a meeting in the Peloponnese with representatives from Saudi Arabia, Bahrain, high-ranking ministers, as well as some Europeans. Did you get any sense of how the issue might be resolved?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: I believe it is difficult to make specific predictions at this time. I think we all understand that the medium- to long-term consequences for the global economy will be quite serious if this war continues. Of course, however, we are not participating in the negotiations. As Greece, we have always supported a negotiated solution. We are particularly concerned about the issue of freedom of navigation; we were concerned about it even before this war began. Historically, this has been a top priority for Greece, as a leading maritime power…
Gideon Rachman: You account for about 25% of global shipping.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: We account for 25% of global shipping, which is why we also have a presence in the Red Sea. Operation “ASPIDES,” a European operation aimed at ensuring freedom of navigation in the Red Sea, is under Greek leadership. Unfortunately, very few European countries have decided to participate in this operation. So, when we argue in the European Council that Europe must be more active in the Gulf, at a time when it is imperative for Europe to build a strategic partnership with the Gulf countries, we must also…
Gideon Rachman: But what is the mission of this operation? For those who are not familiar with it.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: It is an operation to escort commercial ships whenever necessary.
Gideon Rachman: But not yet through the Strait of Hormuz?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Not for transits through the Strait of Hormuz. This is an operation in the Red Sea and off the Horn of Africa. Its main objective was to protect merchant ships from Houthi attacks. Our ships, for example, have engaged and managed to shoot down Houthi drones using Greek-made anti-drone systems. Therefore, it is a successful operation…
Gideon Rachman: And it serves as a potential model for…
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: It could serve as an operational model. One of the issues that could be discussed is the extension and expansion of the mandate of Operation “ASPIDES” to include a different geographical area. However, for this to make sense, we first need a solution through negotiations. I believe it is unrealistic to expect anyone to send ships to a geographical area that is still in a state of near-military conflict.
Therefore, we need, first and foremost, a negotiated solution. And after that, if the need for a peacekeeping operation arises, we in Greece would certainly be willing to participate. We have the model; we’ve done it before, and I would encourage other European countries to seriously consider deploying naval forces to the region.
Gideon Rachman: So you said that freedom of navigation is an extremely important principle for Greece. The Iranians have made it clear that they want to impose tolls for passage through the Strait of Hormuz, and some energy executives I’ve spoken with have said “maybe we should just pay; it would amount to about $1 per barrel of oil, and everything would start running smoothly again.” What do you think?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Absolutely not. Categorically not. We would be setting an extremely dangerous precedent. I believe it would be completely unacceptable, not only for Greece but for almost every other country that benefits from free trade. It’s pure blackmail. We cannot accept it. Europe cannot accept it.
Gideon Rachman: Indeed. And do you believe that this would set a precedent? Obviously, the Strait of Hormuz is extremely important in and of itself, but it would set a precedent for undermining freedom of navigation around the world.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: As I have mentioned, we are a country at the forefront of global shipping, one that believes in free trade. We must not forget that 90% of global trade is carried out by ship. Therefore, any additional costs for maritime transport, or even the possibility that freedom of navigation might be used as a means to achieve geopolitical goals, would essentially destroy what we have achieved over many decades, ensuring that freedom of navigation is a concept that must never be questioned.
Gideon Rachman: I mentioned the heads of energy companies, who have essentially been promoting this idea. Do you think there are governments that would be tempted to adopt it?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: No. Honestly, I haven’t seen any government show interest in this idea, including the U.S., which has made it absolutely clear that we must return to the previous regime.
Gideon Rachman: Although President Trump at one point said something along the lines of “maybe we could share the revenue,” he seems to have abandoned that idea.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: No, I believe that every recent statement by the President makes it absolutely clear that no fee, no additional charge, no payment whatsoever regarding the Strait of Hormuz can be accepted.
Gideon Rachman: But if that is the case, how will you force the Iranians to open them?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: That is part of the negotiations taking place between the U.S. and Iran. There are two fundamental principles that, in my opinion, are non-negotiable: Iran can never acquire nuclear weapons, and we must return to the status quo ante regarding the Strait of Hormuz. But, I repeat, we are not participating in the negotiations, and I imagine that those who are talking with the Iranians will know more.
Gideon Rachman: Yes, I mean, in my own country there were some politicians who openly condemned the decision to go to war from the outset, saying it was a mistake. It’s probably too late to talk about that now, but what is your view? I mean, previously things were working more or less, at least in Hormuz.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: In hindsight, one could draw many conclusions, but I don’t think it’s my job right now to comment on what should have happened three months ago. We have a situation we need to address, and I prefer simply to look to the future rather than dwell on decisions made in the past, which, to put it bluntly, we can no longer reverse.
Gideon Rachman: May I ask you about Greece’s relations with Israel? Because, you know, if I think back to previous decades, I always considered Greece to be a country that had a rather critical stance toward Israel. But today you seem to have quite close ties, even though Israel’s actions in Gaza are particularly controversial.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: First of all, we have a long-standing strategic partnership with Israel, and I would say that this is a consistent foreign policy choice adopted by previous governments as well, including left-wing governments. But precisely because we are strategic partners and have a strong partnership, we also have the ability to speak frankly to our Israeli friends whenever we believe they are making mistakes. We were quite critical of what happened in Gaza. We were quite critical in public of what was happening in Lebanon, and I welcome the ceasefire and the direct talks between the two countries. But this is a strategic partnership with great depth, and we have never…
Gideon Rachman: And what is the basis of this strategic cooperation? What is the common strategic interest?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Thecommon interest in a stable Eastern Mediterranean, but there are also strong economic ties, strong defense ties, cooperation between our defense industries, numerous Israeli investments in Greece, as well as the convergence of our technological ecosystems. This is, therefore, a partnership that is not limited merely to geopolitical priorities.
I must emphasize, however, that at the same time we maintain excellent relations with all other regional “players.” Greece has stood by our partners in the Gulf in times of need. We have honored our strategic partnership with the United Arab Emirates. We have strong partnerships with Saudi Arabia and Qatar. We were present in Lebanon, supporting the Lebanese Armed Forces. We have very strong ties with Egypt. We have demarcated our maritime zones with Egypt and are at the forefront of strengthening relations between the European Union and Egypt.
Therefore, our relationship with Israel does not undermine our strong cooperation with the other countries in the region.
Gideon Rachman: And yet, you know, on the other side of the Mediterranean, there is Pedro Sánchez, who has practically made a specialty of accusing Israel of genocide and framing this as a central issue for Europe. When you meet, say, Sánchez at the European Council, what is the discussion like on such issues?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: We agree to disagree. Sometimes it’s easier, you know, when you’re on the other side of the Mediterranean and don’t feel the tension the way we do, to perhaps view foreign policy through the lens of domestic policy. That happens, it can happen anywhere, but we respectfully disagree with Pedro Sánchez regarding Israel.
Gideon Rachman: A striking difference between Spain and Greece is that Spain ranks near the bottom in terms of NATO defense spending. I think they spend about 2% less...
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Significantly less...
Gideon Rachman: Significantly less. You have been among the top spenders for a long time. Is this mainly due to the historical threat from Turkey?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Greece has fulfilled its obligations to NATO even in times of crisis, because we are in a neighborhood full of challenges and because we have always believed that we needed to invest more in our defense capabilities. Since I took office seven years ago, one of my key commitments has been to strengthen our deterrence posture.
We contribute to NATO, and in doing so, we also contribute to the European Union. I am very pleased to see the results of our overall investment. This is being done without jeopardizing our overall fiscal position, but it is a necessary price we must pay, as we find ourselves in a more complex neighborhood.
We have a very ambitious twelve-year plan regarding our defense investments. Of course, we are all drawing lessons from the conflicts we see today regarding the strengthening of our domestic technological ecosystem. I mentioned earlier that we already have our own capabilities to counter drones, which have been operationally tested in the Red Sea. In this way, we contribute to NATO but also to what I believe should be a key priority for all Europeans: the concept of European strategic autonomy and how we will create a defense space more centered on Europe.
Gideon Rachman: And why is European strategic autonomy necessary? Is this mainly because you share the view that the U.S. … I mean, they have said many times that they will reduce their footprint in Europe and that this is now inevitable.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: First of all, if we want to have better cooperation with the Americans, we must acknowledge that President Trump was right when, several years ago, he said that we are not doing enough to ensure our own security and that we have essentially entrusted our security to the United States. He was right.
Now that we are doing much more, we can engage with the United States from a position of greater diplomatic influence.
At the same time, we must not forget that there are EU member states that are not members of NATO. Take Cyprus, for example. Cyprus was attacked by Hezbollah drones. Greece stood by Cyprus’s side. We immediately sent two frigates and four F-16 aircraft. Five other European countries joined forces with us. In essence, then, we demonstrated our commitment to defending an EU member state that happens not to be a member of NATO.
Gideon Rachman: So, when you speak of European strategic autonomy, in your view, is that not synonymous with the EU?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis:It would certainly have the EU as its foundation, because in our Treaties there is an article, Article 42, paragraph 7, which constitutes a mutual assistance clause. In fact, its wording is much stricter than that of Article 5. However, in Europe…
Gideon Rachman: Article 5 of the NATO Treaty.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Yes. However, in Europe, until recently, we never discussed it. That is why I am particularly encouraged by the fact that we are taking our first “timid” steps to discuss how this article could take on an operational dimension. It is very early…
Gideon Rachman: That would essentially mean transforming the EU, in addition to a single market, into a defense alliance.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Isn’t that what the treaties provide for? Yes, that is what they provide for.
Gideon Rachman: But is it a defense alliance whose members would actually take action? That question is now being raised about NATO. I recall, at the Munich Security Conference, there was talk of Article 42.7 due to all the crises in U.S.-EU relations, and one of the Americans told me: “Oh, the EU is always talking about this; they can never agree on what it means; it’s pointless; it won’t lead to anything.”
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Well, perhaps it’s time we agreed on what it means. And I can tell you that what happened in Cyprus was essentially a de facto, but not de jure, invocation of this article, through a “coalition of the willing.” A number of European countries offered their practical support to Cyprus. We must draw lessons from this example and build upon it.
I am not talking about replacing NATO or anything like that. We must, however, understand that, to a certain extent, having some basic coordination capabilities regarding the decisions we need to make at the European Union level will be useful for our own concept of strategic autonomy. It will also send a message to the U.S. that we take our defense seriously. I believe, therefore, that this is a proposal from which everyone stands to gain.
Gideon Rachman: Do you believe there is sufficient common European understanding of what our security interests are, so that Europeans can truly act as a unified entity in defense? Greece, obviously, has its own specific concerns, but we were saying that Spain is an exception in some respects. When we talk about Russia and Ukraine, the Poles and the Baltic countries take the issue extremely seriously; if we go further west, that concern may diminish.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: In Europe, we speak—this is the European terminology—of a “360-degree” approach to security. What does that mean? Looking, for example, at Russia and Ukraine, I understand the concerns of my friends from the Baltic countries. I supported Ukraine, and I tried to put myself in their shoes. What does it mean to live next to a large, aggressive neighbor?
I expect them, too, to understand my own concerns, to turn their gaze to the Eastern Mediterranean, to the security challenges in our region. To turn their attention to Turkey, a country with which we are trying to build a functional relationship, but Turkey has in the past used strongly revisionist rhetoric. To understand why migration and the situation in Libya could pose a security problem for the entire European continent.
It is, therefore, important for all of us to understand that whatever happens at Europe’s external borders ultimately affects us all. Therefore, I believe it is very important to adopt a more holistic approach to the world and the challenges facing Europe, beyond the main challenge of Ukraine.
Earlier, you asked me about our relations with the Gulf countries. I believe this is an area where Europe should invest significantly more in strengthening our strategic and economic ties, because, ultimately, we probably have more in common than many realize.
Gideon Rachman: Do you think Europeans have adopted an overly passive stance toward the Gulf? They have allowed themselves to be sidelined to the point where they are almost out of the picture. Trump does indeed monopolize the attention; he goes to Riyadh and that’s considered a huge event, while the Europeans, even in diplomacy now, find themselves somewhat on the sidelines. But these things are happening much closer to us...
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: One could argue that this is true. We are a medium-sized country in the European context, but we contribute, to the extent that we can, to strengthening these partnerships.
Gideon Rachman: And do the Gulf countries really take us seriously? I mean, I’ve spoken with some Americans…
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: You know when they take you seriously? When you deliver results. We have sent a battery of Patriot missiles to Saudi Arabia. It has been there since 2021, when they asked for help to defend themselves against Houthi attacks. And Greece was there, present, as were some other European countries. Consequently, they will take us seriously when we move beyond words and when we truly back up our statements with actions. And this, in terms of security, means standing by our friends and allies in times of need. Once we reach that point—and certain European countries have clearly taken significant steps in that direction—I think they will take us more seriously.
Gideon Rachman: Indeed. You refer to Ukraine as the main flashpoint. Interesting things are happening there. The Ukrainians are now striking Russian oil refineries, even in Moscow itself. I don’t know if anyone can feel comfortable about that. This is an escalation of the war. But do you see—as we discussed in the context of Iran—any prospect of an end? Do you see any prospect of the war between Russia and Ukraine coming to an end?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Well, first of all, I’m glad we’ve finally managed to unblock the commitment we’ve made to Ukraine regarding the 90 billion euro in funding, which they desperately need to keep their government functioning and to support their war efforts.
I believe that what they have achieved in terms of developing their domestic defense capabilities is truly admirable and should be studied in detail by our countries’ Ministries of Defense.
I believe that a just peace can only be achieved when there is a certain military balance between the two parties involved. In that sense, it is clear to me—and it should be clear to everyone—that Russia is no longer winning this war. And that is the only way to truly bring Russia to the negotiating table.
Gideon Rachman: Are you optimistic that we will see the end of this war within the next year or so?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: If the cost to Russia is too high and if the benefits of continuing the war are negligible—which seems to be the case from a military standpoint—then probably yes. If they’re losing, you know, 35,000 to 40,000 soldiers a month and realize they’re no longer reaping any benefits by continuing this, they’ll likely have additional incentives to return to the negotiating table.
Gideon Rachman: I assume you’ve met with Putin in the past, haven’t you?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Yes.
Gideon Rachman: I imagine it’s been a while since you last spoke with him?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: I haven’t spoken with him since the war began.
Gideon Rachman: I see. Do you have any sense of what he’s thinking, of whether he’s ready to move toward an agreement?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: No. I have, I repeat, no deeper insight into his way of thinking beyond what is known to the general public. I hope, however, that at some point Russia will realize that it has nothing to gain from continuing this war. And Ukraine has made it absolutely clear that it has the capability, with significant European and American assistance, to defend itself and achieve successes beyond what, in my opinion, Russia expected.
Gideon Rachman: You mentioned the fact that Europe is now finally in a position—in part, I suppose, due to the change of government in Hungary—to allocate the 90 billion euros. Should Europe be doing other things as well, such as demonstrating a greater sense of urgency regarding Ukraine’s efforts to join the EU?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Look, I believe there is a clear sense of urgency regarding European priorities. In my opinion, this relates to the implementation of the strategic priorities we have set as Europe. I was in Aachen last week to honor Mario Draghi, and I had the opportunity to speak again about how urgent it is to address the issues concerning European competitiveness.
You know that Draghi famously said “whatever it takes” in 2012, a phrase that saved the euro. And I ask: what is the equivalent “whatever it takes” moment today, now that we are not facing an acute crisis but the gradual erosion of our competitiveness?
My message is that we must address this challenge with the same sense of urgency. This requires strategic priorities that we have clearly defined: the completion of the Savings and Investment Union, the functioning of the single market, and the effective implementation of the “28th regime,” which I consider an excellent idea, especially with regard to new startups.
Gideon Rachman: That’s an excellent idea that I know nothing about. What is the “28th regime”?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: The “28th regime” is the idea that a legal entity in Europe will be able to operate in any European country without having to obtain licenses and certifications from 27 different national regulatory regimes.
I would therefore say that these must be our priorities at this moment: reducing energy costs and integrating our energy market—something that has clearly not yet happened. So, as for Greece’s agenda—which will also assume the presidency of the Council of the EU in the second half of 2027—these are important issues that I believe are an absolute priority for the European Union.
Gideon Rachman: Ukraine’s accession, not so much?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Ukraine’s accession is an issue we are discussing, but it cannot come at the expense of the ongoing enlargement process, which also concerns our neighborhood. I am referring to the Western Balkans. So, there is an ongoing process. We have mapped out the roadmap for Ukraine. I believe that significant reforms have been implemented in this direction.
Gideon Rachman: Could there be a form of “partial accession”? Because, obviously, there are certain difficulties, as you know, with the Common Agricultural Policy and other issues. Some suggest that, given the political importance of offering them something, there could be an interim solution.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: These ideas have been put forward, but I believe they are still at a fairly early stage. I am not ready to comment publicly on these ideas. What I can officially state is that we have an enlargement process with very clear guidelines. We would like the candidate countries to join as soon as possible. However, the process must be followed.
Gideon Rachman: You spoke about the importance of European competitiveness, and it is very interesting to me as I return to Greece. I think it is never a good sign when journalists frequently visit your country. I came many times during the crisis; now Greece is in a very different position. Do you believe you have truly left all the effects of the crisis behind, or does it still haunt you a little?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: What I can tell you is that Greece today is a very different country from what it was in 2015 or 2019. Just look at our overall fiscal performance. We have reduced our public debt, as a percentage of GDP, at a faster rate than any other country in the history of the eurozone, and it continues to decline.
By the end of 2026, we will no longer be the most indebted country in Europe. And this is a very important legacy for the next generation, because our debt and our inability to get our finances in order have always “haunted” us. We are generating healthy primary surpluses. We are achieving this while simultaneously maintaining high growth rates, cutting taxes, attracting investment, and reducing unemployment.
I therefore believe that, if we examine the macroeconomic performance of the Greek economy, we are clearly in a good position.
However, there are still many unresolved issues. We must ensure that macroeconomic performance translates into a genuinely better standard of living for Greeks. We still face the major and persistent problem of inflation.
As for me, if I manage to win the next term, the real challenge will be to continue on this path toward real convergence with Europe. To complete or continue the necessary reforms—some of which are still underway, especially regarding improving the efficiency of Greek public administration—and to prepare the country for the major trends that will affect us all: demographic changes, the emergence of artificial intelligence as a disruptive force, and the challenge of climate change, which is an urgent issue. So, we still have a lot of work to do.
Gideon Rachman: You know, during the crisis, many European countries liked to tell Greece what to do. Are there now some lessons they could learn from Greece? I’m thinking of my own country, which is struggling with a particularly large debt and a deficit we can’t cover. France hasn’t presented a balanced budget since the 1970s, I believe. What are the lessons from Greece that allow for a primary surplus alongside growth? How is that achieved?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: First ofall, don’t wait until you’re facing an existential crisis to decide to implement difficult reforms. Because that’s the problem I see with many of our European colleagues. We nearly went bankrupt in order to make the necessary changes. And not only that, in 2015, at a time when we were emerging from the crisis, we entrusted the country to the hands of populists, and essentially four additional years and a completely unnecessary third program passed before full recovery.
I therefore believe that the lesson from the case of Greece is that reforms work, and that you must implement the difficult reforms at the beginning of your term. For example, at the start of my second term, I decided to aggressively tackle the problem of persistent tax evasion. It was very difficult politically to do so, but now we are seeing the results. One of the reasons our fiscal performance is so strong is that we managed, for the first time, to tackle tax evasion, using technology as a key tool.
And the only way to address the resurgence of populism is, first and foremost, to acknowledge that some of the grievances on which populists base their arguments are real, but the solutions they offer are usually divorced from reality.
And of course, when it comes to fiscal discipline, if you have persistent primary deficits, they will ultimately hurt you. I will never allow, as long as I have the responsibility to lead this country, for Greece to find itself in that position. Because when you have a healthy primary surplus, the temptation to spend more is great. That is what the opposition is proposing. I will not do that; I will respect the fiscal rules. The European guidelines regarding our fiscal performance are very clear. I will spend only whatever fiscal space I can create beyond the targets I have committed to meeting with the European Union.
I believe the markets appreciate this; this is one of the reasons we’ve seen record levels of foreign direct investment—precisely because, ultimately, the goal is to create more jobs. Unemployment was at 18% when I took office; now it’s even below 8%. We still have an investment gap to close compared to the rest of Europe. But no one will invest in a country unless they feel confident that the fiscal foundations are solid. And believe me, they are very solid.
Gideon Rachman:Let me conclude, if I may, with a question regarding Britain. As you may have noticed, Keir Starmer is facing a challenge. This has essentially opened up the European debate in Britain. One of the candidates—or rather, one of the potential candidates—Wes Streeting, has stated that he believes Britain should rejoin the EU. What is your opinion on this? Do you think this prospect is realistic? Would the other EU countries welcome it?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: I believe that the United Kingdom’s departure from the European Union has been a blow to us all. My first European Council was the last one attended by a UK Prime Minister. I still remember Boris Johnson walking out of the room and waving to us, saying “goodbye and good luck”—I think that’s what he told us. Honestly, I’m not sure if that turned out to be very good for the United Kingdom, but obviously it wasn’t my decision.
We are seeking a constructive relationship with the United Kingdom. It is not for me to say whether, within a generation, the United Kingdom will rejoin the European Union. The rules are very clear. If the United Kingdom wants a strategic partnership, a stronger relationship with the European Union, it must be mutually beneficial. Because at some point, I believe the United Kingdom thought it could have its cake and eat it too, but that didn’t happen.
Gideon Rachman: Thank you very much.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Thank you.